tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3771009444113723863.post433877886194157949..comments2024-03-21T10:33:24.876-07:00Comments on Articuli Fidei: Orthodox Presbyterian Church: "The Overly Prickly Church"David Waltzhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17966083488813749052noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3771009444113723863.post-79401194178697862862010-11-08T18:08:26.978-08:002010-11-08T18:08:26.978-08:00With the name of Allah,
Peace be unto you David.
...With the name of Allah,<br /><br />Peace be unto you David.<br /><br />David you asked,<br /><br />Do most Sunnis accept the Shia (I am thinking primarily of the 12vers) as 'orthodox'?<br /><br />I think most of the traditional Sunni Muslims do not regard the Shi'a as Orthodox they regard them as Muslims with deviant views; however Muslim nonetheless.<br /><br />However, in recent years there have been moves and gestures on both sides for acceptance but in reality this hearkens back to the work I mentioned prior by Imam Al Ghazali "The Boundaries of Theological Tolerance in Islam" -translated by Sherman Jackson.<br /><br />Get your hands on that nugget! <br /><br /><br />Me: It seems from my experience, that when one begins to explore options outside of the 'accepted' bounds (i.e. tradition) within any given paradigm one can expect criticism/opposition in varying degrees from both the clergy and lay members.<br /><br />This is what I love about Islam (Sunnism) the need for having orthodoxy a magisterium ora collective body of scholarship; but at the same time realizing that this body of scholarship can and at times needs to be challenged.<br /><br />Especially in terms of the legal code, though anyone can understand the need for stability in theological formulations. <br /><br /><br />Me: And thank you for your continued interest in this beachbum's musings.<br /><br />And thank you for allowing this country bumpkin to comment on your various threads... :)<br /><br />God bless,thegrandverbalizer19https://www.blogger.com/profile/15600393095781979367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3771009444113723863.post-91047902020072397972010-11-07T21:49:50.627-08:002010-11-07T21:49:50.627-08:00Hi GV19,
So nice to see you back at AF, thanks mu...Hi GV19,<br /><br />So nice to see you back at <i>AF</i>, thanks much for responding to my musings; you wrote:<br /><br />>>I think this is one of the unfortunate consequences of 'Sola Scriptura' or the idea that all human beings are equal. This creates a leveling out of humanity and makes one person feel they are just as capable as the next in all matters.>><br /><br />Me: <i>Sola Scriptura</i> has differing views among the various Christians who claim to adhere to the doctrine/principle. I have noticed that those who 'make a living' off of the Gospel, tend to emphasize the 'need' for teachers; yet, one of common principles of SS is that the 'essentials' can be understood by ALL via SS.<br /><br />>>It would be interesting if the Christians came up with a theological maxim that allowed for divergent opinions within the fold of Christianity but did not necessarily expel a person outside.>><br /><br />Me: I think pretty much the majority of Christians in some sense 'allow' for some divergence; however, the essentials/fundamentals that one is NOT allowed to 'stray' from, seem to vary from age to age.<br /><br />>>We (In Sunni Islam) have done this. That is why you have the four madhabs (legal schools and not one). <br /><br />This is why you have the 3 schools of aqidah( theological schools or approaches that are defensible within the parameters of orthodoxy).>><br /><br />Me: Do most Sunnis accept the Shia (I am thinking primarily of the 12vers) as 'orthodox'?<br /><br />>>I was curious David if you had something of a more personal encounter during your stay with the Presbyterians that you could share with us.>><br /><br />Me: As with my journey as a JW, my days as a Presbyterian were for the most part, a 'positive' experience. My reason/s for 'leaving' the JWs, OPC, and RCC were doctrinal and historical issues, not personal.<br /><br />>>An example of intellectual curiosity that you felt was silenced or shut down by either congregants or those whom the faith had been entrusted to guard.>><br /><br />Me: It seems from my experience, that when one begins to explore options outside of the 'accepted' bounds (i.e. tradition) within any given paradigm one can expect criticism/opposition in varying degrees from both the clergy and lay members.<br /><br />>>Thank you once again for an interesting post.>><br /><br />Me: And thank you for your continued interest in this beachbum's musings.<br /><br /><br />God bless,<br /><br />DavidDavid Waltzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17966083488813749052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3771009444113723863.post-57909786064258694802010-11-06T18:47:15.825-07:002010-11-06T18:47:15.825-07:00With the name of Allah, Peace be unto those who fo...With the name of Allah, Peace be unto those who follow the guidance from their Lord.<br /><br />I think this is one of the unfortunate consequences of 'Sola Scriptura' or the idea that all human beings are equal. This creates a leveling out of humanity and makes one person feel they are just as capable as the next in all matters.<br /><br />It would be interesting if the Christians came up with a theological maxim that allowed for divergent opinions within the fold of Christianity but did not necessarily expel a person outside.<br /><br />We (In Sunni Islam) have done this. That is why you have the four madhabs (legal schools and not one). <br /><br />This is why you have the 3 schools of aqidah( theological schools or approaches that are defensible within the parameters of orthodoxy).<br /><br />I was curious David if you had something of a more personal encounter during your stay with the Presbyterians that you could share with us.<br /><br />An example of intellectual curiosity that you felt was silenced or shut down by either congregants or those whom the faith had been entrusted to guard.<br /><br />Thank you once again for an interesting post.thegrandverbalizer19https://www.blogger.com/profile/15600393095781979367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3771009444113723863.post-50092612159231576482010-11-05T15:50:07.738-07:002010-11-05T15:50:07.738-07:00David
with trepidation I will answer your questio...David<br /><br />with trepidation I will answer your question with a <a rel="nofollow">Psalm</a>.<br /><br />As your question speaks for itself, so the answer, <a rel="nofollow">the Psalm</a>, speaks clearly as well:<br /><br />the question:<br /><br /><i> why such a lack of the "fruit of the spirit" (e.g. love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, meekness, self-control) among supposedly 'like-minded', 'regenerate' believers; why the lack of true unity; is there a 'root' cause to the seemingly endless schisms?</i><br /><br />The Psalm as the answer:<br /><br /><b>Psa 143:1 A Psalm of David. Hear my prayer, O LORD; give ear to my pleas for mercy! In your faithfulness answer me, in your righteousness! <br />Psa 143:2 Enter not into judgment with your servant, for no one living is righteous before you. <br />Psa 143:3 For the enemy has pursued my soul; he has crushed my life to the ground; he has made me sit in darkness like those long dead. <br />Psa 143:4 Therefore my spirit faints within me; my heart within me is appalled. <br />Psa 143:5 I remember the days of old; I meditate on all that you have done; I ponder the work of your hands. <br />Psa 143:6 I stretch out my hands to you; my soul thirsts for you like a parched land. Selah <br />Psa 143:7 Answer me quickly, O LORD! My spirit fails! Hide not your face from me, lest I be like those who go down to the pit. <br />Psa 143:8 Let me hear in the morning of your steadfast love, for in you I trust. Make me know the way I should go, for to you I lift up my soul. <br />Psa 143:9 Deliver me from my enemies, O LORD! I have fled to you for refuge! <br />Psa 143:10 Teach me to do your will, for you are my God! Let your good Spirit lead me on level ground! <br />Psa 143:11 For your name's sake, O LORD, preserve my life! In your righteousness bring my soul out of trouble! <br />Psa 143:12 And in your steadfast love you will cut off my enemies, and you will destroy all the adversaries of my soul, for I am your servant.</b><br /><br />One should note the exhortation of the great Bible scholar, Saul of Tarsus, converted by Christ and summarily known afterwards as Paul the Apostle, after the answer settles upon your soul, here:<br /><br /><b><i>Rom 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.</i></b>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com